The Value of Vintage T-shirts + Winona Forever
Hey WNVM-ers
Fawnia’s back on the vintage concert t-shirts beat. In the name of work, she ventured into the zoomer-filled Hypebeast x Depop Flea in Greenpoint, Brooklyn to investigate why vintage band tees cost so damn much, and who’s really driving the market. Her X-ness has never been more apparent, as her pants were not even close to being big enough to go undercover. But she found some interesting answers, and some hilariously savage quotes from the experts.
In You Oughta Know news, Winona Ryder charms the pants off every single person she speaks to, a shocking confession about “My So-Called Life,” and LL Cool J gets some well-deserved long-form coverage.
Even If It's Old Junk, It's Still Rock ‘n Roll to Me
Why vintage band and concert t-shirts are so expensive, and how Gen X nostalgia drives the market
By Fawnia
While planning a quick stop in Baltimore in May, I ended up in a deep, deep Etsy rabbit hole of vintage concert and band t-shirts. I scrolled through Milk & Ice’s shop and almost screamed when I saw a circa-1992 Kris Kross “Jump” graphic tee, and then yelped at a Color Me Badd one, complete with a big ol’ “CMB” logo on the back.
But, the $200 price tags gave me some sticker shock. I still remember when I scored my precious Def Leppard “Hysteria” 1987-88 tour tee for $75, which now feels like an absolute bargain. Of course, memories associated with the songs of my youth remain priceless, but media does not compensate us properly (and Cheryl and I could use some more paid subs — hint hint!) Intrigued, I played a little popularity contest as I ventured further into my online spiral. Example: An exquisitely worn-in raglan t-shirt from Led Zeppelin’s 1975 North American Tour commands $925, but a similar style from lead singer Robert Plant’s 1982 debut solo album seems like a steal at $85. (Poor Robert Plant.)
I had so many questions: Which bands and what decades are the hottest? Who’s shopping? And are they even true fans? (“Hysteria” is my favorite Def Leppard album.)
So which bands/artists are the most in demand?
“It definitely goes through phases,” says Leisure Centre’s Frank Carson, as I considered spending $108 on a turn-of-the-century t-shirt emblazoned with the evergreen Ricky Martin’s face. (Ooh, now it’s $98, and he was robbed of an Emmy nomination for “Palm Royale,” btw.) Carson namechecks proto-grunge Sonic Youth and ‘80s Scottish rockers Cocteau Twins as “hot at the moment,” along with Y2K boy bands — because, yup, that's now considered “vintage” — and classic Madonna.
Carson explains that sellers are always on the hunt for “slightly underexposed” artists to create fresh demand — thus explaining why hair band tees from the likes of my early-’90s mixtape regulars Slaughter, Skid Row, and Cinderella fetch upwards of $300.
“People find out about something ‘new’, popularity spreads, and they become really expensive or desirable. Then they get reproduced back into the mass market, so it becomes less interesting,” he continues. “It really is crazy how fast the cycle turns.”
But, some artists are like the steady Procter & Gamble stocks of the vintage t-shirt market. “People are always asking me if I have shirts from The Cure,” says Donovan Levy, owner of Baltimore’s TrashXCloset. “ Sometimes I'll have clients who are older than I am — maybe in their 50s — and everyone is asking me for The Rolling Stones or a Grateful Dead shirt.”
Does age matter?
“Not to generalize, but I've noticed that [artist and decade preference] really depends on the client's age,” says Levy. I mean, my t-shirt collection — ‘80s and ‘90s Phil Collins, Bon Jovi, more Bon Jovi — makes me a poster child for Gen X nostalgia-induced purchasing. I also cannot tell you how many X-ers expressed regret for casting away their once-cherished mementos after our nostalgia concert-themed issue, also featuring t-shirt authenticating tips from Levy:
“Gen X-ers really want the ‘80s band tees and stuff,” confirms Maison, who runs Vintage Vin (@mdfvintage on Grailed.) “Like, the older crowd that either donated, gave away, or doesn't have it anymore. Those are the people that value it because they were there to watch it, like witness it. So the kids now don't really appreciate it as much.”
Disinterested in relics of the MTV Generation, zoomers are more into circa-2000s memorabilia, like ‘NSYNC, Britney Spears, and Avril Lavigne. Whereas millennials, who came of age during the Clinton era, want “a lot of ‘90s grunge stuff, like Nirvana, Pearl Jam, and Alice in Chains,” says Levy.
Does the actual music even matter?
I often think back to the time I threw on my tried-and-true Def Leppard tee to stop by a Gen Z-targeted makeup pop-up. I attempted some light jokey conversation with an early-20-something wearing a vintage-esque, but most likely Urban Outfitters-copped Mötley Crüe shirt. “Love that we’re both repping hair bands today,” I said, as she responded with a blank stare. So do the zoomers actually like, or even know, the bands on their shirts?
“I don't think so,” says Levy. “I think some do, but a lot of people find that the shirt or the [the artist’s look] on the shirt is more of an extension of themselves and their personality.” So it's not about connecting with the music, but harmonizing (sorry) the aesthetic. Like a person with an affinity for ‘70s-inspired caftans, denim short-shorts, and floaty floral dresses might look for a Fleetwood Mac or Tom Petty shirt from the decade.
I mean, I can relate. There are a gazillion fun and easy ways to style these shirts, and they always start a conversation. When I went to interview “The Boys” star Karen Fukuhara in person (and at the old “TRL” studios!), I wore my The Police sleeveless sweatshirt paying homage to Jack Quaid’s band t-shirt devotee character, Hughie. She complimented my outfit as “cool New York City girl,” which eased us into the conversation (and felt flattering.)
“It’s a total fashion statement,” agrees Kellyn of Best Friends on Substack, although she’s more of a purist when it comes to sartorially proclaiming fandom. The Nashville-based millennial inherited a “super-worn in” Ramones t-shirt from her brother, a true aficionado of the legendary late-’70s/early-’80s punk band. “There's the fashion aspect of [wearing it], because I love the way that it looks,” continues Kellyn, who hasn’t worn it out yet. “But I would be too embarrassed that somebody would be like, ‘Oh, you're a Ramones fan?’ Like, ‘no.’”
So what are real fans looking for?
The most discerning band t-shirt connoisseurs are on the hunt for the ultimate rarity: bootleg concert and band t-shirts, like my friend Aldo’s pretty amazing superteam-up of M.C. Hammer, Kool Moe Dee, The Boys, and Oaktown’s 3.5.7. (Brings me back to afternoons watching “Yo! MTV Raps” and BET and I want him to give me that shirt, below.)
“People value some of the parking lot tees more than they do the [official] shirts because they're harder to find,” says Maison.
Levy explains that tees by certain bootleg artists, like Ed Donohue and his signature silkscreen and tie dye creations, proffer the most clout, as well as highest price-points. A collectible Donohue purple swirled Grateful Dead tee, with a red rose motif, runs for $599 on eBay. “A true enthusiast would be wearing that shirt,” says Levy, who also owns hand-screened t-shirts by ‘90s-era artist collective Mosquitohead (above).
“I have a Misfits one, which is my most valuable shirt. It’s worth around $1250 or $1300, in my opinion,” says Levy. For comparison, this comprehensive round-up of Mosquitohead’s coveted shirts features national treasure Dolly Parton ringing in at $4,000 and Elvis Presley at $1,399. “They're really like works of art.”
How does pricing work?
“Most band tees have a market value,” says Carson, who researches price points of comparable shirts, in terms of artist, album, tour, year, etc, via Etsy, eBay, and other on and offline resources. “That will inform my decision, but won't make me decide that it's a certain price. Mine is more based on what I think I could sell it for, and then I take away a little bit because I want people to have this stuff.”
Levy finds people will pay the most for ‘70s and ’80s punk, and ‘90s grunge artists. “I sold a Soundgarden shirt for like $1,000,” he says. “Even [vintage-inspired grunge era] shirts that were sold in Hot Topic, and they're a dime a dozen, people are spending a lot of money on them.”
Like wedding dresses and anything baby related, perhaps band t-shirts are recession-proof, thanks largely to the nostalgia factor driven by the sentimental Generation X. Maybe because we can afford to wallow in nostalgia; X-ers control 30% of the total wealth in the U.S, and, compared to younger generations and boomers, drop the most on apparel.
“[Gen X is] more appreciative,” says Maison, a millennial ‘80s and ‘90s music fan who’s searching for a The Smiths tee of his own. “They're more willing to spend up, like they're more willing to pay my price than the Gen Z-ers. Or even the millennials for that matter.”
We are two Gen X journalists who analyze all the '80s and '90s nostalgia in current pop culture, fashion, and beauty. Read more stories like this one here!
You Oughta Know
Thanks to the imminent release (Sep 6!) of Beetlejuice Beetlejuice, Winona Ryder has been everywhere. First up, Jimmy Choo announced she would be the face/feet of the brand’s fall campaign. It’s a nod and homage to the ‘90s, when the shoe brand got big, according to the brand’s creative director, Sandra Choi. She noted that Ryder’s “films and her aesthetic are symbolic of the decade…” Meanwhile, on the interview and podcast circuit, Ryder told the New York Times that on the first Beetlejuice film, someone actually wrote out an entire Handbook for the Recently Deceased; it wasn’t just a prop. She told the LA Times that she still exchanges hand-written letters with Keanu Reeves(!) and Daniel Day-Lewis. And on the “Happy Sad Confused” podcast, she confessed that she always wanted her character Lydia to end up with Beetlejuice. She truly is a treasure and we can’t wait until she is on the road again for “Stranger Things.”
LL Cool J gets the profile treatment on the eve of the release of his first album in 11 years. The piece acknowledges the now-elder statesman of hip-hop as being the first solo M.C. without a crew to make it big (at 16!). The writer, who honestly seemed to have a bit of a crush on him, compared his enthusiasm to "a musical theater kid.” [New York Times]
Hyundai produced an electric concept car inspired by its 1986 Grandeur sedan, and it looks fantastic. Why are modern cars so curvy and boring? Bring back automative angles and personality! [Complex Instagram]
A poorly reviewed movie (the Washington Post called it “popaganda”) about Ronald Reagan starring Dennis Quaid — that we hadn’t heard of before now — actually did pretty well at the box office over Labor Day weekend. About 85 percent of moviegoers were over 35, “including an unheard of 66 percent over the age of 55.” What exactly are we doing here, Gen X and baby boomers? [The Hollywood Reporter]
OK, sorry, just one more Beetlejuice item: Jenna Ortega has continued her run of red carpet outfits inspired by the movie with her best one yet. The green gown by Harris Reed is made of upcycled wallpaper and was inspired by Delia Deetz’s batshit sculptures. The house bag is the perfect finishing touch.
A confession: Cheryl has never seen a single episode of “My So-Called Life” and Fawnia has seen maybe one. It is the short-lived show’s 30th anniversary. Should we watch it? We do not care for modern-day Jared Leto. [Vulture]
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Chiming into say yes to watching My So-Called Life! It's such a Gen X time capsule, but the storytelling and performances are beautiful, and still hold up. (But totally understand about the Leto of it all.)
I’ve never seen My So Called Life either!!! 😱